Home Forum Ask A Member ’57 Fastwin mystery – please help

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  • #201744
    andy
    Participant

      US Member - 2 Years

      Hello from Pawleys Island, SC! I’ve owned this motor 10 years. (when I first started running it https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fWK4meTGLoE ) When it was given to me it had sat in a barn many years. Then it sat in my garage over a year before I cleaned the carb, installed new ignition, impeller and resealed the lower unit. In all that time it was always free. In other words, the engine never locked up. I would pull the rope just to rotate the motor whenever I’d think about it. July of 2018 again had been sitting a year in the garage. When I went to pull the rope this time, it was locked up. I was able to free it up by turning the flywheel by hand. I put wd-40 in the bores and rotated it until it turned somewhat normally. It was still not perfectly smooth. I then installed new spark plugs, started it and ran it on the hose for a while. I changed the lower unit oil and ran it some more. It sounded and ran normally. Two weeks later I went to pull the rope and it was locked again. I didn’t touch it again until today. I pulled the recoil starter off and without much effort got it to move with a wrench on the flywheel nut. I pulled the plugs and bypass covers and see nothing abnormal in the bores or on the pistons or rings. After around 10 minutes of working it back and forth, I was able to get her to turn almost totally smooth with the plugs out. There’s one spot that has the slightest resistance. Anyone experience this or have any ideas? Something obviously changed and it wasn’t the storage.
      Thanks,
      Andy

      '48 Zephyr, restored '06, runs great
      '54 Fastwin, restored '09, runs great
      '57 Fastwin, unrestored, locked up in 2018

      #201750
      billw
      Participant

        US Member - 2 Years

        Fastwins get locked up all the time. Don’t know why the power heads do that. Maybe the carbon seal on the bottom of the crank has let go. Maybe the head gasket is leaking a bit. Maybe the exhaust cover is leaking, although I never really saw that one on an FD/Fastwin, even in salt water. IS yours in salt water? If so, it could be the water jackets are failing. Speculation. First, divide and conquer: Pull off the lower unit and make sure it’s not the LOWER unit that is binding….Then report back.

        Long live American manufacturing!

        • This reply was modified 4 years ago by billw.
        #201753
        frankr
        Participant

          US Member

          I know where Pawleys Island is—-right slap on the Atlantic Ocean. And I’ve got a pretty good idea what’s wrong with your motor. Salt water is getting into the powerhead. Not wanting to be a pessimist, but your motor probably is terminal. billw probably aced it. The three most likely water intrusion routes are the lower crankshaft carbon seal, and the head gasket and exhaust cover gaskets. And yes, the inner exhaust cover may have a pin hole corroded through it, which will squirt water right into the exhaust ports.

          No matter what the leak is from, the water getting into the crankcase will rust the roller bearings over nite, and the motor is junk. You might get it freed up, and even run it, but if those bearings are damaged it WILL fail.

          Sorry ’bout that.

          • This reply was modified 4 years ago by frankr.
          #201773
          andy
          Participant

            US Member - 2 Years

            I agree about the water intrusion and yes Pawleys Island is on the Atlantic. It’s weird but the mainland, where I live, has the same name as the island itself. The other thing is I live on what’s technically a peninsula. I’m 1.3 miles to the ocean and 2.5 miles to the Intracoastal Waterway/Waccamaw River. The river is fresh here unless there’s a really bad drought when it gets slightly brackish on high tides. I do 99.5% of my boating in fresh water and has been a really long time since this motor has seen salt. The previous owner lived on the river but I can’t really say if they ever took it over to the island and used it in the salt water creeks over there. That said I realize the crank could be trashed. It seems like there was only a very small amount of water, just enough to stick a ring or two. The first thing I did today was to remove the lower unit. It’s free. I suppose if it is the carbon seal, the water was sucked in right onto the crank. It so, that’s junk. Did they make the inner exhaust cover out of stainless in ’57? I’m going to do some experimenting with compressed air to see if I can locate the leak.

            Thank you both for the advice and info!
            Andy

            '48 Zephyr, restored '06, runs great
            '54 Fastwin, restored '09, runs great
            '57 Fastwin, unrestored, locked up in 2018

            • This reply was modified 4 years ago by andy.
            #201777
            frankr
            Participant

              US Member

              I can’t say for sure if the cover is stainless or not. But you can tell simply looking at the edge, between the gaskets. If it is thin, about like a credit card, it is stainless. But if about 1/8′ thick, aluminum.

              Good luck with your motor. It sounds like you know what you are doing. I live here on the Gulf Coast of Florida, so been there, done that.

              #201783
              andy
              Participant

                US Member - 2 Years

                I’m pretty sure the inner cover is aluminum. Does this look like the carbon seal has been leaking? I’ve never had one leak so I really don’t know what evidence can be seen here if any.

                57_bottom_seal2

                '48 Zephyr, restored '06, runs great
                '54 Fastwin, restored '09, runs great
                '57 Fastwin, unrestored, locked up in 2018

                • This reply was modified 4 years ago by Mumbles.
                #201785
                frankr
                Participant

                  US Member

                  Can’t tell. We are looking at the bottom of the baffle plate, and can’t see the seal.

                  #201787
                  andy
                  Participant

                    US Member - 2 Years

                    Thank you for your help. I need to either pull the power head or trash it and trashing it is just not in my blood. The problem is most of the fasteners are going to be frozen and some will surely break. I guess I’ll just tear into it and work on it as time and patience allow.

                    '48 Zephyr, restored '06, runs great
                    '54 Fastwin, restored '09, runs great
                    '57 Fastwin, unrestored, locked up in 2018

                    #201806
                    billw
                    Participant

                      US Member - 2 Years

                      You never know for sure whether a power head is trashed or not, until you take it all apart. Yeah, most times it is, but…..Recently I received an FD from member Fleetwin. The flywheel didn’t even ROCK, never mind turn. It was pretty obvious that the motor had seen salt. Even the steering was frozen. I wanted it mostly for the lower unit; but I’m not one to waste a single part, either. Based on previous experience, it was against my better judgement to even take the power head apart. To my surprise, when I did, I found that I could reuse every single bearing, worked really carefully and freed the rings and now have a power head that will be a great runner. Okay, the crank had some discoloration but no pits.

                      What I am trying to say is, if you like that Fastwin, don’t count it out just yet. If it were mine, I would first start by getting it running in a barrel on 24:1 mix, then fog it out, to preserve what’s left.. Then pull the power head and look at the carbon seal. If it’s broken, there you go. If the o-ring inside it is rock hard, maybe that’s all the problem is. At that point, you can decide whether to go further.

                      Regarding the my salty FD, this was the first time I tried using a small, battery-powered impact gun (Milwaukee) and a Snap-On, straight blade screw driver bit. I was AMAZED at how the very corroded, 1/4″ screws mostly just backed right out. In all the power head mounting screws and exhaust cover screws, I only broke ONE.

                      Long live American manufacturing!

                      • This reply was modified 4 years ago by billw.
                      • This reply was modified 4 years ago by billw.
                      #202138
                      andy
                      Participant

                        US Member - 2 Years

                        Bill,
                        This motor ran perfectly when I stored it in 2017. Then in 2018 when I found it locked up, I easily got it free, then ran it on the hose for a while and it ran great. Two weeks later, it was locked up again. I freed it up again easily last Saturday. My theory is the inner exhaust cover has a pinhole that allowed a small amount of water into a cylinder causing a ring or two to stick. If that’s correct, the crank might be just fine. My current plan is to confirm or deny a bad inner exhaust cover and reevaluate. I was able to remove the rear lower motor cover which allows access to the bottom two bolts that fasten the exhaust cover. The top 3 bolts came out but the other 6 won’t budge even after soaking for 3 days. I’m considering experimenting with some muriatic acid. My theory is the aluminum oxide from the exhaust cover is preventing the penetrating oil from getting to the threads. I plan to apply a small amount of acid to the base of the bolt head in the hopes of dissolving the aluminum oxide. Has anyone tried this?

                        '48 Zephyr, restored '06, runs great
                        '54 Fastwin, restored '09, runs great
                        '57 Fastwin, unrestored, locked up in 2018

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