Home Forum Ask A Member 1960 johnson 10hp bad miss

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  • #5810
    davesko
    Participant

      Just finished my 1960 johnson 10hp. New coils,points,condensers,water pump impeller and carb rebuild. Starts easily and runs a few minutes and then goes into what i can only explain as a lean miss, then clears up and runs for a while just fine. Seems that the miss is at low speeds only. Replaced carb with a know good one and it acts the same. Could it be upper crank seals? Thanks in advance for your help. Dave Hershey pa

      #48363
      frankr
      Participant

        US MEMBER PAY BY CHECK

        Can we assume you have tried simply turning the slow speed needle out a tad to richen it up? More to your question though, sure it could possibly be the top seal —or the lower seal. It could also be some other crankcase leak. But before you go those places, how about the carb/spark synchronization? Carb opening too soon will make it sneeze.

        #48366
        davesko
        Participant

          I adjusted the slow speed and it didnt help, I will check linc and sync. Thank you frank

          #48367
          Steve A W
          Participant

            Is the gas tank vent clear?

            Member of the MOB chapter.
            I live in Northwest Indiana

            #48368
            nali
            Participant

              Though also about the tank vent 🙂
              Bad condensors can do it too, when they get hot. It doen t take long.
              I don t know much about outboard, but struggled with a lot of "Mobylette" :p

              #48372
              davesko
              Participant

                vent is clear, tried know good tank also. condensers are new. motor will run fine for 5-10 minutes then goes into the lean miss.

                #48374
                nali
                Participant

                  A "new" condensor can be really bad if it’s NOS.
                  I m not the best mechanic about outboards, but I suppose that if it runs great for 5 or 10 minutes, carb and bad fuel are not to blame.

                  I highly suspect a bad condensor.
                  You can find moderns for just a few cents. Worth a try.

                  #48397
                  fleetwin
                  Participant

                    US Member

                    Well, I am assuming this engine is new to you, so you don’t know how it ran before you did the service work. This is a 1960 model, so there is no pressure tank, or pressure port tap on the intake manifold, correct? I ask only because a faulty pressure tank set up/manifold could surely make the engine run just as you have described. Have a look at the intake manifold to see if it looks to have been disturbed from original.
                    I would certainly check simple things first before getting in too deep. You would have seen evidence of oil spray under the flywheel while doing the ignition work if there was a problem there. I am assuming you did not disturb the upper seal components.
                    You mention that adjusting the low speed needle has no effect on the running quality at idle, is this correct? Like Frank says, are you sure the carb synchronization is correct? Perhaps the carb butterfly is sticky/jammed/damaged causing the throttle plate to be held open slightly at idle. What condition was the carb in when you cleaned it up? Did you inspect the low speed needle? Perhaps it is damaged/broken.
                    The other pesky quality about these carbs is that the low speed needle threads inside the carb are just in an aluminum sleeve that is wedged between the low speed needle packing and mixing pocket. So, if the packing nut is too loose, or the packing is missing damaged, you will go crazy trying to adjust the carb….You can turn and turn the needle, but you are not changing the adjustment…The threaded collar is just turnining inside the carb! Do you understand what I am explaining? Did you replace the packing and see the removable callar? The same thing will happen if the needle/collar threads are damaged. I wish I understood why OMC made a crazy design like this, must have been a cost savings…
                    Again, stick with the simple things first…The fuel pump could be funky creating an air leak into one cylinder, but usually the engine would run out of gas and keep stalling if there was a fuel pump problem. You could try pumping the fuel bulb while the engine is idling poorly to see if this helps. If pumping the fuel bulb helps, then you need to consider the fuel pump/inlet fuel lines/filter. You have tried a different tank, did you try a different fuel hose as well? Please do not disassemble that fuel pump, unless you have proved that the fuel pump is bad. Those original fuel pumps were not rebuildable, and there are no repair parts available.
                    A funky ignition system could certainly cause this condition, but a lean spit is usually carb/fuel system/manifold related. Although it simply can’t hurt to pull the flywheel inspection cover to be sure the points are still adjusted properly, and the flywheel isn’t rubbing on one of the leads. How did you adjust the points? Did you use Frank’s tool, or just set them to .020"? Will the spark jump a 1/4" gap?
                    Finally, keep in mind that the simplest of all solutions could just be one of your new spark plugs is NG! It does happen sometimes…
                    How about your thermostat, did you inspect/replace it? The engine won’t idle well if the thermostat is missing/stuck open.

                    #48415
                    davesko
                    Participant

                      Thank you all for the great info, the syncro is correct and i am going to change condensors and check the fuel pump. Motor was not running when i got it so i did the usual complete overhaul, carb kit,coils,wires,plugs,points,condensors,impeller,gearcase seals like i always do but this thing just wont cooperate. Gonna check all your suggestions and report back. Btw i even went as far as to take the carb off my perfect running other twin of this motor and still did the same thing. Thank you guys for all the help and suggestions this motor is exeptionally nice and really hate to give up on it.
                      Thanks again, Dave sko

                      #48420
                      fleetwin
                      Participant

                        US Member

                        OK, well that is good info, different carb, same bad idle….So, I guess we can rule out carb issues, and the syncro is OK….
                        I am assuming you checked compression and that is OK. Any signs of a crankcase leak between the two halves, or perhaps on one of the bypass covers? Again, have a close look at the intake manifold to see if someone has been messing around in there. Perhaps you have a bad reed, or messed up gasket, but I wouldn’t rip into the manifold until the other simpler choices have been looked at.

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