Home Forum Ask A Member 54 Johnson RD15A top seal (still) leaks

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  • #23584
    fleetwin
    Participant

      US Member
      quote david bartlett:

      Frank,

      Thank you for taking the time to take this motor apart and send the photo’s. Very educational and enlightening. The old adage of a picture being worth 1000 words holds true.

      Absolutely right, thanks Frank!!

      #23590
      olcah
      Participant

        US Member

        Yes, the seal lip is down and the bearing face looks ok. No sign of any damage on the carbon seal face. I will try WD40 on top of the seal in the next week and report back.
        Thanks to all.

        #23948
        olcah
        Participant

          US Member

          Monday I took the seal apart. Here is with flywheel off.
          http://i77.photobucket.com/albums/j66/c … 2354008343
          Here is the top of the carbon. It was quite dry.http://i77.photobucket.com/albums/j66/c … 6c7jrk.jpg
          But top of motor is oily wet.
          http://i77.photobucket.com/albums/j66/c … 2354195020
          At 3 o ‘clock you can just see the drain channel in the seal area. http://i77.photobucket.com/albums/j66/c … 1442267976
          Put wd40 in seal area and it drained right down to the reed plate area, can barely see a drop on the screwhead so the drain is not blocked.http://i77.photobucket.com/albums/j66/c … 2354582278
          The carbon itself is smooth and near dry. It was step face down with a square ring that was installed last winter. No sign of any leakage past that ring.http://i77.photobucket.com/albums/j66/c … 6w5jvi.jpg
          The bottom of the magneto plate is oily with oil into the magneto bearing .http://i77.photobucket.com/albums/j66/c … l1e0fl.jpg
          Can this be leaking through the crankcase joint – although by spinning the crankshaft with just a wrench I could not see a leak? I would appreciate any opinions How difficult is splitting the crankcase and resealing?

          #23953
          chris-p
          Participant

            I dunno, looks like someone went a little crazy with a thin grease when they installed the mag plate and it got flung around?

            #23967
            frankr
            Participant

              Exactly, what Chris said. That looks like liquified grease, not crankcase oil. Crankcase oil would be as clear as the stuff you put in the tank—at least until it mixed with grease and wear particles from the plate swivel mount. Wash it down and reassemble with just a thin smear of EP grease on wear surfaces. Any excess does no good and just gets flung out by vibration.

              #23998
              olcah
              Participant

                US Member

                I had this happen before so use almost no lube. But given your comments I will wipe it off, put it together dry, and see what happens.
                Thanks.

                #24005
                fleetwin
                Participant

                  US Member

                  Well, I have to admit that the operation/theory of that seal/drain system does not make sense to me, even though I understand how it is supposed to work. I guess the best set up would have been to have the oring around the bearing AND put the drain system above the oring.
                  In any event, doesn’t look like anyone has had that crankcase apart. Did you do the test that Mumbles showed online with the drill/socket spinning the engine with the plugs out? Be careful with the drill, the motor might spark igniting crankcase fumes. If so, did you plug off the fuel tank pressure port? I’m not sure which cylinder it is plumbed into, but left open it will make it harder to do mumbles’ test.
                  I would not pull that crankcase apart, remove the support and clean everything up with brake clean like others have mentioned. I doubt the crankcase spaghetti seal is bad, block could be cracked/porous though.

                  #24012
                  jeff-register
                  Participant

                    US Member

                    I’m clueless but if someone has changed it to a fuel pump motor & removed the pump reeds (the two small ones) if that would then provide a crankcase pressure very high via the oiler line to the top seal? Maybe it has too much pressure from another & is blowing by?

                    #24023
                    olcah
                    Participant

                      US Member

                      Fleetwin, I have not tested as mumbles did as I do not have a drill with enough oomph to spin the motor over. Seems to me that I would want to do that with spark plugs installed to get compression pressure. Also it could damage the pump impeller without water.
                      Jeff the motor uses a regular pressure tank and does not have a fuel pump.
                      Thank you both.

                      #24028
                      fleetwin
                      Participant

                        US Member

                        The engine will still develop crankcase pressure, even with the plugs removed. You could put the gearcase in a bucket of water if you are worried about the impeller. But again, you will need to plug the fuel tank pressure port for this test to be effective, I now recall that both cylinders are plumbed into the pressure port. Simply remove the pressure hose and plug it off, or you could make the tool Frank uses if you have a spare two line tank female connector.
                        I guess I am trying hard to keep you from splitting that crankcase, resealing it, only to have the same problem re-occur. I really don’t think there is a problem with the spaghetti crankcase seal, only because the pictures show the powerhead has never been split. It would be very hard to find a porous/cracked crankcase by inspecting it visually after disassembly as well. I am hoping that pressurizing the crankcase will help isolate the real leak/problem, seeing exactly wear the leak is occurring will help find/rule out crankcase leaks/imperfections. Mumbles wasn’t spinning his flywheel nut very fast, he might not have even been using an electric drill. You will want to have the carbon seal properly installed for this test though.
                        The only other issue that may be causing this situation is an engine that is running lean at idle and constantly backfiring. Every time the engine backfires/coughs, a strong crankcase pressure pulse is developed, which may overcome the sealing ability of the carbon seal/drain circuit.

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