Johnson JW-16 3 hp This and That

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  • Buccaneer
    Buccaneer

    US Member - 1 Year
    Replies: 4605
    Topics: 790
    #237708

    My brother-in-law dropped off a couple of outboards that he’d like new impellers
    and L.U. seals in.
    I have the JW tore down already, and noted that there’s a pretty deep
    groove where the driveshaft seal rides. Not sure there’s much room
    to adjust the new seal in a different place or not, but perhaps.
    MarineEngine does sell new driveshafts, but not sure if my B-I-L is going
    to want to spend $100 for one.
    I noticed that the driveshaft has the same splines on both ends, and the same
    length of splines, but the top side splines has a square cut o-ring groove in it.
    Q. Have any of you flopped the driveshaft around on these JW’s after machining
    a o-ring groove and drilling a little hole for the impeller drive pin?

    When I pulled the driveshaft out of the power head, there was no o-ring in the groove.
    Didn’t see chunks fall out either.
    Q. Is there any way the o-ring could be “stuck” up in the power head?
    Doubt if I can see up there with a flashlight, and don’t plan on pulling the
    power head! Thanks.

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    Prepare to be boarded!

    • This topic was modified 1 week, 4 days ago by BuccaneerBuccaneer.
    • This topic was modified 1 week, 4 days ago by BuccaneerBuccaneer.
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    crosbyman

    Canada Member - 2 Years
    Replies: 2054
    Topics: 225
    #237715

    interesting option to flip and regroove the shaft for a O-ring….

    if your b-i-l balks on a shaft for $100 just tell him he will get himself a running kicker which does not seem to bad considering the cost of a new eqv HP motor+ taxes 🙁

    JW are good little motors for trolling and… not-rowing back to shore 🙂

    Joining AOMCI has priviledges 🙂

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    fleetwin

    US Member - 2 Years
    Replies: 3775
    Topics: 38
    #237738

    Well, flipping the driveshaft would require drilling another hole for the impeller pin…I wouldn’t chance it…Find a decent used driveshaft….
    The oring could be stuck up near the powerhead, but I doubt it…
    Tip the powerhead upside down, spray some WD40 down inside the crank splines.. Manually insert the driveshaft in and out of the crank several times to clean out rust/old dried lube. Tip the powerhead back upright and insert the driveshaft only about half way into the crank splines and try rocking it back and forth to see how much play/wear might be present in the crank splines… Your pictures aren’t that clear, can’t really see the wear in the seal area, but the upper splines appear to have some wear.
    Was the gear oil milky/watery when you drained it? Perhaps the gearcase was holding oil OK in spite of the groove.
    This becomes a judgement call at this point. Obviously your beloved BIL doesn’t want to spend a nickel on this thing, but expects it to be like new after you get done with it…If the gear lube looked “OK”, you may just want to put the thing back the way it is before getting in too darn deep on this project…

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    crosbyman

    Canada Member - 2 Years
    Replies: 2054
    Topics: 225
    #237744

    or…just tell B_I_L to by a gallon of 90 grade oil and change gear oil a few times during the year or twice a season for ice fisherman.

    colonoscopy the power head grooves 🙂 for comfort

    Joining AOMCI has priviledges 🙂

    Buccaneer
    Buccaneer

    US Member - 1 Year
    Replies: 4605
    Topics: 790
    #237750

    Thanks for the replies. I’ll see what route the BIL wants to go with it.
    The gear case oil was pretty good, and he didn’t notice any leaks
    on this one.
    The carb must not have been run out of gas last time used. It was laying on it’s
    side when delivered, and when I stood it up, gas and crud ran out
    of the lower unit driveshaft housing drain, and some out of the
    water pump intake.
    I just bought a milling machine, and if it was “my” motor, I’d be
    trying to drill a hole and machine a groove to flop the driveshaft
    end for end. Think I’d find an old driveshaft on a scrap motor
    to practice on first though.
    The splines looked good at first glance, no rust or other signs of water
    messing up the splines on either end, nor the gears.

    Prepare to be boarded!

    Buccaneer
    Buccaneer

    US Member - 1 Year
    Replies: 4605
    Topics: 790
    #238003

    I did a little experimenting with a scrap driveshaft from a Gale, to
    see how hard it would be to flip the JW’s driveshaft “end for end”
    to have a good surface for the driveshaft seal.
    With the DRO and edge finder, locating the exact spot to drill
    was no problem at all. I drilled an 1/8″ hole with a center drill,
    but I need an 1/8″ endmill to make a “flat bottom” hole the correct
    depth for the impeller drive pin. Said end mill on order.

    The other item of concern is a new o-ring groove on the driveshaft,
    where it goes into the power head. I didn’t think a parting blade would
    be the best weapon to use on an interrupted cut in the splines, on a hard shaft,
    so I made a holder today for my Dremel to mount in the lathe tool
    post. I installed a little “cut-off” wheel in the Dremel and it appears
    it will make an o-ring groove if one feeds “slow and easy”.
    Brother in law said to “go for it”. If it turns out okay, I’ll report back,
    otherwise, forget you ever read this!

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    Prepare to be boarded!

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    bobw
    bobw

    US Member - 1 Year
    Replies: 1383
    Topics: 46
    #238009

    Good luck with it – hope it works!

    Bob

    1954 Johnson CD-11
    1956 Johnson RD-18
    1958 Johnson QD-19
    1959 Johnson QD-20
    1957 Evinrude Fastwin 18

    "Every 20 minute job is only a broken bolt away from a 3-day project."

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    billw

    US Member - 2 Years
    Replies: 1463
    Topics: 45
    #238018

    I admire the will of many in the club to do walk-arounds to solve problems. Sometimes I do them, too. The milling machine sure adds a lot of potential. So that being said, I feel like a kind of Negative Nellie but I am concerned about how the pinion gear is going to hold squarely on the shaft, with the old o-ring groove in it. In a three, the drive shaft is held square by the shaft, not a bearing. The only things the gear housing does for the pinion is have a bushing to stop upward movement of pinion and hold the drive shaft laterally. I’d also be worried about the groove damaging the bushing, depending where that groove ends up running.

    The best equation ever written is Time=Money. In this case, YOUR time equals HIS money. $100 for a brand, spanking new drive shaft really isn’t that bad. I’ll shut up now.

    Long live American manufacturing!

    Buccaneer
    Buccaneer

    US Member - 1 Year
    Replies: 4605
    Topics: 790
    #238025

    I admire the will of many in the club to do walk-arounds to solve problems. Sometimes I do them, too. The milling machine sure adds a lot of potential. So that being said, I feel like a kind of Negative Nellie but I am concerned about how the pinion gear is going to hold squarely on the shaft, with the old o-ring groove in it. In a three, the drive shaft is held square by the shaft, not a bearing. The only things the gear housing does for the pinion is have a bushing to stop upward movement of pinion and hold the drive shaft laterally. I’d also be worried about the groove damaging the bushing, depending where that groove ends up running.

    The best equation ever written is Time=Money. In this case, YOUR time equals HIS money. $100 for a brand, spanking new drive shaft really isn’t that bad. I’ll shut up now.

    Bill, I’ll recheck this morning before I do any machining on the shaft,
    but I think the o-ring groove is not riding in the bushing, but yet
    high enough from the end, where the pinion gear will have lots
    of contact area on the splines.
    Thanks for mentioning.

    Prepare to be boarded!

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    dave-bernard

    US Member - 2 Years
    Replies: 1362
    Topics: 18
    #238040

    just add the o-ring both ends

    Buccaneer
    Buccaneer

    US Member - 1 Year
    Replies: 4605
    Topics: 790
    #238055

    The spline length’s are the same on each end of the driveshaft, and by
    looking at the driveshaft while inserted into the pinion gear, the spline
    probably goes up into the lower bushing a liitte ways.
    The o-ring groove ends up at the very bottom of the bushing,
    and I don’t think it’s going to bother anything.

    I machined the new o-ring groove this morning. I think it will be okay.
    Not sure what size o-ring is actually suppose to be in there, but
    new one is order with the rest of the parts.

    The machining didn’t leave any noticeable burrs, but I ran a wire wheel in a drill along
    the splines to polish the area up. It slid in pinion gear first try.

    Awaiting a 1/8″ endmill before I drill the impeller drive pin hole.

    The original powerhead end of the driveshaft has more wear on the
    splines, but hopefully not enough to cause disaster…… wouldn’t
    think it would be a big issue on a 3 hp.
    Hopefully the machining on the driveshaft will be a good trade-off
    to keep water out of the gear case.
    In the photos the “magic marker” indicates the original seal area
    that’s worn, wider and deeper than it looks.

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    Prepare to be boarded!

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    Buccaneer
    Buccaneer

    US Member - 1 Year
    Replies: 4605
    Topics: 790
    #238246

    Yesterday I got the 1/8″ endmill in the mail, so I bored the new hole in the driveshaft
    for the impeller drive pin.
    Today, the parts from Marine Engine showed up and I got the JW back together
    and test ran in the barrel. So far, so good. Pumping water well, and no oil leaks yet!

    It took longer to get the cowling and the spring load front panel properly in place
    and bolted on that putting the gear case and water pump together.

    Thought I was going to have a “low speed” lean miss issue, but it was just
    the low speed needle turning in on me every time I tried to align and tighten
    the knob……. aggravating invention!

    Tomorrow the 9.5 Johnson’s turn for new seals and impeller.

    Prepare to be boarded!

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    fleetwin

    US Member - 2 Years
    Replies: 3775
    Topics: 38
    #238279

    sounds nice!

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