Home › Forum › Ask A Member › 2000 Johnson 50hp 2 stroke questions.
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fleetwin.
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April 14, 2019 at 12:29 pm #173327
I bought a pontoon with the above engine and there are a couple issues. First, there is a lever on top of the throttle/shift lever which lifts up. I assume that is a neutral fast idle lever? It appears to do nothing, so maybe disconnected? Is there a fast idle stop screw that can be adjusted to kick up the idle a bit?
Second, the power tilt works, but the motor gradually lowers by itself – I don’t see a place to add oil to the mechanism. I assume a leaky seal somewhere? Also, the motor has a manual adjustable tilt like the old style motors with a tilt pin that can be moved. The pin is in the first hole which is too low. However, the power tilt interferes with placing the pin in the other holes. I may be able to place it in the last hole, which may be too high a tilt. Do these motors depend on the power tilt to maintain the position?April 14, 2019 at 8:45 pm #173402If the fast idle lever does nothing when lifted, most likely there is something wrong with the control box….Have an assistant lift the control warm up lever while you are watching the cable back at the engine to see if it is moving. Perhaps the sync/link/control cable adjustment at the engine is messed up causing this symptom…Perhaps the control cable is kinked, or too long with too many bends in it….
There is only one seal on this PTT unit, and it is where the tilt cylinder piston comes out of the cylinder…..I’m thinking you would be able to see any leakage in this area….Are they any other external leaks evident? The unit is filled when the engine is in the full tilt up position, be sure to support it somehow while you are working under there. Remove the large fill plug located near the top of the unit, then add GM dexron II transmission fluid (red), or the OMC power trim/tilt fluid (golden color) until it overflows out of the fill hole.
http://www.marineengine.com/parts/johnson-evinrude-parts.php?year=2000&hp=50&model=BJ50PLSSM&manufacturer=Johnson§ion=Power+Trim+%26amp%3B+Tilt
The fiill plug is #30 in the diagram, the manual release valve is #8.
Check the manual release valve it should be tight….Try backing it off a bit and retightening it….Please remember to support the engine in the full tilt up position while messing with the release valve so the engine doesn’t come down on your fingers….Once you have filled the unit and checked the manual release valve, run the unit up and down a few times, let it bottom on both ends of the range to get any air out of the system….I’m assuming this is a fresh water unit, trying to loosen release valve on a salt water unit could be futile…. If problems persist, I would order a new manual release valve….You must remove the snap ring in order to remove the release valve completely….Once it is out, check to see of the little rubber seal is still present on the inner end of the valve. Oil will probably leak out if you remove the release valve, so you will have to fill and bleed the system again….
And yes, the power trim unit is more than capable of holding the engine in any position, if the tilt pin can not be moved to the center hole…This engine does have a trim position sender mounted inside the port stern bracket, so you can easily add a trim gage on the dash to help position it correctly at slow speeds…April 14, 2019 at 9:26 pm #173407I haven’t noticed any leaks, but I’ll check when we go to the lake on Wednesday. If it’s low on fluid, would that cause the motor to slowly drop down? Is the fill plug in the front or back of the cylinder? Can I use a squirt oil can to add oil? I don’t really need to tilt the motor too often, so I’ll see if I can move the tilt pin to the third hole to keep the motor in the optimum running position. Seems the PTT unit interferes with the holes.
April 16, 2019 at 6:42 pm #173587Well, low fluid probably wouldn’t cause it to leak down, and you would probably hear the pump gurgling and surging….But, this is a good place to start….Does the engine leak all the way down when tilted up fully? The fill plug should be accessible/visible when you tilt the engine up, it is not positioned between the engine and the transom…Again, please support the engine while working under there so you don’t get hurt…Using an oil squirt can is a great idea for adding fluid, add fluid until it starts to leak back out of the hole when the engine is tilted up fully. Have a look at that manual release valve I spoke about in my earlier post.
April 17, 2019 at 8:23 pm #173637When I removed the filler plug, fluid actually ran out. So I squirted some more in and quickly replaced the plug. I checked the manual release plug and it was tight. No sign of any leakage. Ran the unit up and down a few times, but she still slowly drops down.
April 18, 2019 at 7:24 am #173654OK, the unit was full, so no external leaks…
You loosened, then tightened the manual release valve, but still leaks down…
The only other shot you have is to order a new manual release valve, I would probably order some of the rubber tips/orings also, looks like the might be sold separately… Once you remove the old manual release valve, check to see that the rubber tip did not fall off the old valve, and it might be laying inside the cavity, which could cause further problems….
Once you have ruled out the manual release valve, that means there is an internal problem somewhere requiring unit disassembly….A project better saved for winter time, when you can remove the engine from the boat….
Sorry
DonApril 18, 2019 at 11:37 am #173664There are single & double acting cylinders. Sounds like yours is single acting, pumps the cylinder rod out of the cylinder & gravity compresses the rod back in. A double acting cylinder pumps up one side & drains the other side. When stopped pressure is kept on either side of the ram to hold position. Like Don said, valving or ram O-ring leaking causing pressure bypass. I’ve seen O-rings get soft & flip in the bore as travel happens. Every time it dumps fluid to the other side of the ram. That would make down travel slow too as it’s having to bypass fluid again.
April 18, 2019 at 1:36 pm #173678OK, the unit was full, so no external leaks…
You loosened, then tightened the manual release valve, but still leaks down…
The only other shot you have is to order a new manual release valve, I would probably order some of the rubber tips/orings also, looks like the might be sold separately… Once you remove the old manual release valve, check to see that the rubber tip did not fall off the old valve, and it might be laying inside the cavity, which could cause further problems….
Once you have ruled out the manual release valve, that means there is an internal problem somewhere requiring unit disassembly….A project better saved for winter time, when you can remove the engine from the boat….
Sorry
Don
I didn’t loosen the manual release – just assured that it was tight.
April 23, 2019 at 10:16 am #174284Just to add to what Don was saying. Loosening the manual release valve and pulling the unit up and down manually could dislodge any small piece of debris on the face of the valve? Otherwise you will have to pull the valve to see if the face (rubber) has been damaged. There is a rebuild kit:
http://www.marineengine.com/newparts/part_details.php?pnum=OMC0435567
This includes all the parts you might need for any internal problems. O-rings, seals, etc. If you look at the exploded view on MarineEngine.com the unit has poppet valves (6) (hard to make out) on the piston of the cylinder. A small piece of trash under any one of these valves can cause the unit to leak down. They are just balls with spring behind them. Except for one. Keep them In order. These act as impact protection and a blow off of sort to let the motor come up under control if submerged object is hit.
As in any hydraulics cleanliness is critical when dealing when the internals of the unit. You will need a heavy duty spanner to remove the top cap. I can loan you one as I have rebuilt many of these units.
The trim unit will come out of the back of the motor without removal from boat. It’s a matter of trimming the engine up, supporting engine. Unhook top eye of cylinder and then trimming the cylinder back down. After you have the unit out trim it back up. (Minimal loss of fluid if ram is all the way up. Then unhook electrical to move to the bench for disassembly.
It is a detailed disassembly and assembly process so do the simple things first. You may just dislodge a piece of trash and save yourself a lot of work!Dan in TN
April 23, 2019 at 1:32 pm #174286Just to add to what Don was saying. Loosening the manual release valve and pulling the unit up and down manually could dislodge any small piece of debris on the face of the valve? Otherwise you will have to pull the valve to see if the face (rubber) has been damaged. There is a rebuild kit:
http://www.marineengine.com/newparts/part_details.php?pnum=OMC0435567
This includes all the parts you might need for any internal problems. O-rings, seals, etc. If you look at the exploded view on MarineEngine.com the unit has poppet valves (6) (hard to make out) on the piston of the cylinder. A small piece of trash under any one of these valves can cause the unit to leak down. They are just balls with spring behind them. Except for one. Keep them In order. These act as impact protection and a blow off of sort to let the motor come up under control if submerged object is hit.
As in any hydraulics cleanliness is critical when dealing when the internals of the unit. You will need a heavy duty spanner to remove the top cap. I can loan you one as I have rebuilt many of these units.
The trim unit will come out of the back of the motor without removal from boat. It’s a matter of trimming the engine up, supporting engine. Unhook top eye of cylinder and then trimming the cylinder back down. After you have the unit out trim it back up. (Minimal loss of fluid if ram is all the way up. Then unhook electrical to move to the bench for disassembly.
It is a detailed disassembly and assembly process so do the simple things first. You may just dislodge a piece of trash and save yourself a lot of work!
Dan in TN
Thanks, Dan. Sounds like a winter project. I may try loosening the manual release screw and see if that helps. I really don’t need to use the power tilt on a regular basis, as the motor seems to push the pontoon ok with the tilt all the way down. And I can tilt it up and put the lock on the motor when not in use to keep the L/U out of the water. Now I just need to resolve the idle problem. The fast idle lever does nothing, so I guess I need to open up the remote control and see what’s going on there. Even when warmed up, the idle is pretty low, and I’ve got the idle stop screw on the motor cranked as far as it will go. I’ve done the link and synch and adjusted the slow speed carb needles, but nothing seems to bring the idle up. This motor is too new for me. Maybe I should look for a 50’s or 60’s 35-40hp! At least I know what I’m doing on those motors.
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